What You Missed On The Vector Episode 19: “State of the Space Economy in 2024”

Written by: Morsiell Dormu

In this engaging episode of The Vector, Kelli Kedis Ogborn, Vice President of Space Commerce & Entrepreneurship at Space Foundation, discusses the 2023 global space economy with Lesley Conn, Director of Research and Digital Programming at Space Foundation. Together, they delve into the findings from the latest edition of The Space Report, which quantifies the space economy at $570 billion for 2023 and highlights key trends and opportunities shaping the industry.

Highlights include Conn’s insights on:

• The Global Space Economy: Conn explains how The Space Report provides a comprehensive analysis of global space activities, including commercial revenues, government budgets, workforce issues, and infrastructure. The 2023 figure of $570 billion reflects a revised total from 2022, emphasizing year-over-year growth and the increasing contributions of commercial space, which now accounts for a majority of the global space economy.
• Government Spending Trends: Governments from 54 countries were analyzed, showing that 80% maintained or increased their space spending in 2023, despite economic challenges. Conn notes a significant shift toward defense spending, driven by geopolitical events like the war in Ukraine, which underscored the importance of space-based assets for real-time information and national security.
• Emerging Areas of Growth: While traditional sectors like satellite manufacturing, launch vehicles, and ground stations remain dominant, emerging areas such as space situational awareness (SSA) are gaining traction. Funding for SSA tripled year-over-year, signaling growing recognition of its importance in managing orbital congestion and debris.
• Lunar Activity and the New Space Race: Conn highlights the resurgence of lunar exploration as a key driver of economic and scientific activity. With government and commercial missions to the moon ramping up, she predicts significant opportunities in cislunar infrastructure, mining, and research, fueled by collaborations between agencies like NASA and private companies such as Intuitive Machines and Astrobotic.
• Commercial Space Stations: Conn identifies private space stations as an underappreciated but transformative area of growth. She anticipates breakthroughs in in-space manufacturing and research, particularly in fields like pharmaceuticals and advanced materials, as new platforms become operational.
• Artificial Intelligence in Space: AI is emerging as a critical tool across the space economy, from satellite operations to manufacturing and big data analytics. Conn emphasizes AI’s potential to manage the increasing volume of data generated by satellites and to enhance capabilities in areas like anomaly detection, space debris tracking, and investment analysis.
• Opportunities for New Entrants: Conn advises new entrants to align their priorities with their strengths, risk tolerance, and business models. She highlights diverse opportunities across the value chain, from providing support services for launch operations to addressing critical needs like orbital debris management. Success, she notes, requires a strong business plan and an ability to adapt to the evolving space ecosystem.

This episode offers a comprehensive overview of the trends driving the global space economy, from traditional revenue streams to emerging opportunities in lunar exploration and AI applications. Conn’s insights emphasize the importance of strategic alignment, adaptability, and collaboration across governments, commercial entities, and new entrants. Whether you’re an established industry player or a startup, this conversation highlights actionable strategies for thriving in the dynamic and expanding space ecosystem.

Episode Transcript

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

Hello everyone and welcome to the Vector where we discuss topics, trends, and insights driving the global space ecosystem. I am your host Kelli Kedis Ogborn, and today’s episode is All Things Space Economy. The Space Foundation just released our new space economy number ranking the 2023 year as 570 billion. And here to talk about this growth is no better person than our very own. Lesley Kahn, who is the director of research and Digital Programming at Space Foundation. In this role, Lesley oversees content for the space report and she and her research team produce an annual analysis of the global space economy, which you’ll hear today, which has been a foundational analysis for the space industry since 2006. Additionally, the space report also includes regular analysis of global workforce issues, space infrastructure and space policy issues. Prior to joining us at Space Foundation in 2019, Lesley was an editor and writer at Gulfstream Aerospace. Welcome, Lesley

Lesley Conn:

Kelli. Thank you so much. Very happy to be here.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

No, I’ve been so much looking forward to this conversation because of course I get to chat with you often about space economy issues, but this recent release of the Space report was very exciting and also interesting because it hits on a myriad of topics, which I really want to dig into you because you are the expert of the data and really give some insights for our viewers. But before we dive into all of that, I do want to ask you to talk a little bit about the space report as a product, the different sections that you look at, and really the research and analysis team and the work that you guys do.

Lesley Conn:

Gladly we’ll do that. Thank you. So I think the first thing to know is I may be the one who’s either brave enough or crazy enough to be the face of the research and analysis team, but a lot of what we do, everything really we do is from a team approach of extremely talented analysts who really have a broad spectrum of background. And so we as a team look at in our quarterly editions, but also through occasional white papers or web posts, we really try to look at the full spectrum of what’s happening in the space industry.

The Space Foundation has been producing this space report since 2006, so that really is an advantage because we have nearly 20 years of data and expertise that we can look at. I do think that it’s our global economy number that really is kind of the ringing bell for the whole industry because it’s that annual update where we are able to say, let’s look at everything that’s happening globally. We are looking just one year back as opposed to other analysis that might be two to three years back. Really what we do, we look at commercial revenues and then we spend a lot of time also looking at government budgets and what government is spending. Even though commercial is increasingly the larger part of that economic driver, government is still the initial spark in many cases, and so that’s why it’s really valid to look at that. So the economy, as I said, is really kind of maybe our most well-known analysis, but again, we do, as you noted, we look at space workforce issues. We track both US numbers and some global numbers. We track launch analysis, payload deployment. We also will delve into policy issues, and that can be both within the United States and in Europe or Japan. Really wherever we see the activity or the leading edge activity developing, we try to look at that, analyze that and provide really some maybe beyond the immediate headline analysis.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

Well, and that’s why I was so excited to get you on today and to be able to talk about this because as you just mentioned, people talk about space in the space economy in lots of different ways. They’ll talk very high level just statistics and projections or they’ll get very nuanced, but you really look across the spectrum to be able to identify the drivers and the push and pull of the different areas that is quantifying this opportunity. And I’m going to pull on one of the words you said earlier is you’re crazy enough to be the face of this, but I appreciate you doing that because on my end of the spectrum, when I go out and talk about the space economy, I think that it’s important the work that you do because it gives some validation. When we talk about opportunity and we talk about these pathways for new entrant, we’re able to then point to the information and the data to back it up, sort of the sister to crazy as I think judicious is the word that I’m going to pull in because what I appreciate too is the scrub that you guys do really puts a lot of thoughtful emphasis on these drivers.

And I wanted to actually throw this next question at you to really highlight how you guys do go about quantifying, because I know that the 2023 total of five 70 was actually based on a revised total that came from 2022. So can you talk a bit about how the analysis continues to ebb and flow in between the years of putting out these space economy numbers and what really is that left method of analysis and how did you arrive at the number of five 70?

Lesley Conn:

So what we do is we look at a number of industry reports on the commercial side. We gather those globally. Then internally, we spend a lot of time looking at government budgets, and over the years even the number of governments has increased pretty dramatically. So this year we looked at 54 nations or government entities. What we do though is we’ll look again at really on the commercial side, the large established drivers, things like ground stations and equipment, the launch industry will do direct to tv. We are now looking at things sectors such as, or I would say a sub-sector such as space situational awareness we looked at but didn’t spend a lot of time this year, although we anticipate soon we will be really looking at things such as artificial intelligence or really pulling out and trying to do separate analysis of lunar activity. So we can recognize some of that through both the commercial and the government side.

But for some of the more established sectors, again, like satellite manufacturing launch vehicle activity, we’ve really been tracking that over these past 15, 20 years, and those are still really the major pots that we look at the last few years though there really has been a lot of volatility after the coronavirus pandemic. So one of the things we saw initially is that the space industry actually was buffered from some of the immediate effect because of long-term contracts, because of the long lead time and development, so much of that was already in process and funds were committed that initially there was some real stability. What we saw, however, on a government side a year or two later, is in that immediate response period, governments were shifting and some did focus in more emergency response pandemic areas. So some countries did see a fallback in spending that has since largely not only recovered but continued to climb.

One other thing though that this year in particular was a challenge is because of what was happening from an economic standpoint, pure economy, that the difference in currency exchange and valuations was very volatile. So we typically will go back and always look at revised numbers from at least a year prior. It just refines that lens for us. It also makes sure that over time as we’re looking at say, compound annual growth rate, it assures that we are more accurate over time. So those are some of the internal things that we look at. Some of the other things we have to look at, we don’t always get as much as we would like to have every single defense budget and every single classified program down to the penny. Oddly enough, governments don’t really like to share that information. So in terms of space defense and classified programs, we will do a lot of conversation. We will have meetings where we try to get a better understanding of what’s happening, and then we do some calculations based on that that we feel gives us a good sense of classified spending. That is also a major component in space defense.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

Yeah, well, and you can only work with the information and the data that you have. And I think the interesting point that you made is about the space industry being somewhat shielded from covid and then a lot of the, I don’t want to call it a recession, but a lot of the inflation and increases that we’ve seen across industries, and I know that from your 54 countries, about 80% maintained or increased their spending, which I think is quite tremendous because it shows not just the vitality of the space ecosystem, but also the importance of it and all of the different things that it brings to bear, not just for earthbound applications, but also for in space applications. And I’m curious from your perspective, as someone who follows these trends very closely and looks at the numbers, was there anything that surprised you in this new data that came out for 2023? And on the other side of that, I’m also going to ask what you expected to see.

Lesley Conn:

I think from an expected standpoint, sadly what we’re seeing is a greater shift from pure science missions into increased space defense spending, especially since the Ukraine war, that was really such a marker in time in terms of how space-based assets can be used in real time to enhance information that is needed to address aggression so that with other geopolitical concerns, we are seeing that there is a shifting into increased defense spending.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

Obviously

Lesley Conn:

National defense has to be a priority. All nations want to keep their people safe, but unfortunately, I think while public awareness still lags on the value of space, what has been occurring is that there are some hard decisions having to be made regarding defense spending for space assets versus more pure science programs. So that we expected to see in some areas it was a little more aggressive than even we had anticipated. I think though a couple of nice surprises are some nations are showing really strong commitments even on the civil space side, France, Japan, South Korea, New Zealand hasn’t. While they’ve been very proactive and very excited and very focused in what they’re doing, we didn’t see their spending jump as much as France or Japan. But I think that’s another indicator of just the strength of the global space economy is that more and more nations are realizing the contribution of space to their economies, to their workforce development and even to their information.

So that was a bit of a pleasant surprise. We also saw space situational awareness funding triple year over year. Now it is a very small amount comparatively 61 million I believe, to 200 million. I think my math is right there because it’s a smaller sector, a slight change can really be really significantly looking. It’s still fairly small. The largest market that we have position navigation and timing, which is about I believe 200 billion annually that saw an 11% increase year over year. So even some of these really big sectors are showing growth. It’s just that as a percentage value because they’re so big, it doesn’t move the needle as much as say SSA on the other side space tourism, that number slowed a little bit year over year. So those were some of the standouts I think as we looked at all the data.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

That’s a really good framework to go from and especially when you talked about trade-offs in budgets and if it goes toward civil space missions, which are generally science, exploratory and defense. And I know that in the space report it did say that there was about an 18% defense increase across the board globally, which to your point is tremendous. And we have been seeing that trend since not 18%, but an uptrend since the Ukrainian conflict happened. I’m curious your perspective on for new entrants, for people that have capabilities that they want to bring to bear, what can they extrapolate from that? Is the better opportunity for them right now to look into the defense supply chain areas or how should they really think about their strategy when they want to engage in the broader space ecosystem

Lesley Conn:

First? That’s a really good question, and I think it depends somewhat on what they identify as their priority. So some of the smaller nations really just want to be able to step up and become part of that community. And so for some smaller nations, we are seeing a partnering with larger nations, the United States or ISSA or Japan, more established space nations where they just want to get a cube set, they want to be part of that active space community, or they also have more critical climate conditions or agricultural conditions, drought conditions, crop management issues. And so if they’re identifying that as a priority, having that earth observation data becomes a driver. But it also is a bit, even at that very early level, again, it is an elevator for them in terms of being part of that global community. Other nations are really using space as a way to focus on workforce development and economic development.

So the United Kingdom is a really good example of that. Scotland in particular, in terms of the increase in the satellite manufacturing that is happening Europe and well, the United Kingdom and Sweden for example, are both working very proactively to be able to say that they’re the first European nation that within Europe can do orbital delivery delivery. So sort of depends on the priority. Poland for example, for the last few years, we have seen triple digit percentage increases in space spending. Last year was another good example of that, but they had been really looking at being more of an information center, a hub for Europe. Now they’ve got some higher defense priorities. Luxembourg is a good example of they’ve identified that they really want to be a leader in terms of lunar and asteroid mining. That’s another sector that has long been envisioned and promised, but it really isn’t established. But they are working very closely. They’ve identified that area as something where they have a lot of expertise and they see that they can really gain ground in that sector.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

Well, and I like your framing of priority driven because you’re absolutely right. In order for countries or individuals, quite frankly to become part of space, it needs to make sense for them in their bottom line. And I think what’s exciting is that there’s 92 plus countries that have an active satellite in orbit. And so to your point, people having an orientation to space, having a heritage in space is really critical. And then how they expand upon that and what makes sense for the locality is really where you focus shifting to. Another priority that we have seen, maybe not broadly global, however, definitely growing is lunar activity. And you alluded to that in your previous answer, and both or actually the United States, China and Russia have all announced plans to send humans back to the moon in 2023 countries, us, India and Japan, all attempted moon landings.

And then there were three commercial companies and intuitive machines actually was the first private company to actually land on the moon. So there’s definitely this urgency and necessity for some to take advantage of lunar activity. When you look at that landscape, what comes to mind for you? Because if you think about the origins of our space industry, it was a lunar space race, and at that time it was national posturing. We did it because we could. Now I think there’s partially some of that, but there’s also a lot of scientific and commercial benefit on the backend. So what do you make of this new lunar race, the sis lunar landscape that is going to evolve and what does that signal for the economy

Lesley Conn:

First, from an economic standpoint, I think it’s signals tremendous opportunity. I think that’s why you’re seeing more nations being willing to invest in that. But I think also at long last, we’re just so close to really watching this blossom. Part of that is really so much because of what is happening on the commercial side and what is happening because agencies such as NASA and ISA we’re willing to invest and say, we want to try to foster this growth, growth, growth both from a government standpoint, but then from a private standpoint as well with intuitive machines and astrobotic and iSpace.

There is such a shared recognition and a shared commitment to getting to the moon that I think it’s going to happen. It’s just a matter, it may not be a single government landing a vehicle on the lunar surface. It may be that yes, there’s some government funding that continues to drive that, but it will be on the commercial side and that we may see, and there are a number of upcoming missions for the return intuitive machine. And Astrobotic specifically, I believe within the last, let me try to do my math. The last three months I believe DARPA through its Luna 10, one of the grants that they announced was to Northrop Grumman to do a lunar rail system.

Just so many neat things happening and even still sort of unexpected opportunities, I think from one of the missions that Columbia Sportswear provided some material that was like an insulator. Well, they’ve now had huge marketing feed off from that, but they’ve also done some of their own product development. So I really think that’s where we’re at, that finally the idea that we had in the sixties or seventies, that the technology and the base is broad enough that it’s going to happen. And I think for a majority of people, again, who are not within the industry, they will be stunned by how quickly it will happen.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

I agree. I think that the refocus on the moon is certainly exciting for everyone because we all see it. It’s kind of in our collective mind, but now that it’s back on the table from a tangible aspect of people to engage and not just for us to do it, and not just to learn from it, but to your point, there are very tangible benefits, whether it’s future science and exploration missions or real commercial opportunities that they’re trying to build toward in the future. And I liked how you framed and you were really hitting at this integrative approach that’s going to be necessary because it’s not just governments. It’s not just companies. It has to be this coordinated effort to be able to utilize different funding streams, maybe integrate capabilities into a broader supply chain and pipeline like this Northrop Grumman railway grant. And it is just a very exciting time to think about, and I’m curious from your opinion, so what would be something that to you would be very exciting, however other people might miss? So you analyze trends and data really closely, and so something to you is like, yes, this is going to move the needle forward, but other folks might just think it’s a data point.

Lesley Conn:

I don’t know that I’ve identified the one thing that everyone has overlooked. If so, I’d probably be creating a corporation and getting busy myself. But I do think that there is really not enough recognition or wider understanding perhaps or excitement for what’s happening in terms of commercial space stations.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

Good point.

Lesley Conn:

From a research standpoint, that has been such a huge benefit from a pharmaceutical standpoint. But I think also from an in-space manufacturing standpoint, once you have some updated platforms, once you have really private researchers being sent up by their companies, I think that could really be a trigger for some rapid advancement.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

That is definitely an area that will unlock so much potential and opportunity for different capabilities. And to your point, access to space for things like pharmaceuticals and organ on a chip growth and tissue engineering and all of these really tangible biomedical implications for terrestrial use that we’ve scratched the surface, but we aren’t at a high enough yield to be able to scale it.

Lesley Conn:

And I think there’s also some energy possibilities, some sort of off earth solar development or some, there’s really just a lot of exciting things happening. I mean, the more we’re talking, I’m like we’re also really close to some new engine developments and some new ways of really high speed space travel. So let’s hope that our focus can stay on the advancement side and the science side because there are a lot of brilliant minds at work and a lot of passionate people who are doing great things in space.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

Yeah. Well, and you alluded to an area earlier of artificial intelligence that is also one of those critical industries that I think can completely transform a lot of aspects in space. And in the space report in particular in this new release, you guys did mention that a lot of AI practices are being used not just for the design, well for the design, but also the manufacturing aspects of a lot of spacecraft. Because if you talk about demand, 90% of all spacecraft launched in 2023 were commercial. And so that is not slowing down. Satellites are continuing to go up and other aspects. And so artificial intelligence, I think two has the opportunity to completely transform the way that we think about space and engage in not just the design of spacecraft, but also future missions

Lesley Conn:

And really also from just a big data standpoint. So from a science side, from an astronomy side, we know that AI has been used for a long time to look at all of the data being gathered by Hubble and James Webb. But as more and more commercial companies put up satellites and start refining data, they’re getting massive amounts of information. The human mind collectively just cannot do what AI can do in terms of scanning and identifying anomalies in data or trends in data. So how that will continue to grow and evolve is also a real potential.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

So where would you advise new entrants and high growth companies to focus their attention? Because there’s a lot, right? And I think that you did a very good job at cataloging what’s traditionally and currently driving the economy. So ground stations and position navigation and timing and these broadband, these classical terms. But then there’s these new areas, these new emerging areas of engine design and artificial intelligence and lunar activity. Where should be the focus point? Or again, is it back to priority and business model

Lesley Conn:

Model, maybe more business model? I do feel though that this is the point where there should be a message under my screen that is not a financial advisor. If you saw her, you wouldn’t take her advice. But I do think there really is abundant opportunity both from the new nascent ai, what’s next on orbit manufacturing end of the spectrum, but also increasingly I think there’s a wider portal for all kinds of businesses. So for example, ULA, the work that they’re doing on the Vulcan Center that has created a lot of downmarket demand and activity

For everything from how do we get the launch vehicle from point A to point B, so a new vessel being ordered, there’s a lot certainly as we put more and more assets into space and we start looking at all the possibilities, that means more need, more demand for microchips, how will those evolve? How will those be modified so that they are harder for the space environment? So that is certainly something to look at as we send more people into space, how do we outfit and equip those astronauts or private astronauts? Italy has gotten Prada to help design spacesuits, so there are just so many opportunities. I think part of it has to be looking at your business, really knowing what are your strengths, what opportunities come from that, and then really doing an analysis of your appetite for risk and your capital structure, your funding structure to see can you move beyond that?

Can you step two or three or four points beyond what you traditionally do? So I think a lot of it is experience, comfort level, risk, appetite, the capital infusion. One of the things though that we have been hearing again and again, especially from an investment side is sort of those initial heady days of venture capitalists coming on board and going, Hey, this sounds amazing. Let’s give it a try that they are now better understanding that space really is a long-term venture and it can be a high risk venture. So the more you enter into this space business realm, some of the business fundamentals really apply, which is you need to have a really good business plan. You need to understand and be able to articulate what your product will be, how you can differentiate yourself that your supply lines are set, that you have vendors on hand that they would be able to ramp up as you ramp up. So I think maybe if you start with that framework, then you start looking at how is the global space economy mushrooming and expanding, and then you try to identify your trajectory based on that.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

If I had some confetti, I would throw it across the screen to you because you hit on so many important aspects, and I liked the point that you made about not just having a good business plan, but being able to show your work. Because what is interesting about the evolution, and I think it’s a smart thing, is we’ve moved past hype and PowerPoint companies to companies that actually have to show a viable business model and be able to have some sort of humility about pivoting if their product and service is not going to evolve the way that the space ecosystem is evolving. And so there is this close watch of what’s being advanced, what might be detracted, because everything is sort of holistically building together. And one of the things that I also appreciated you saying because we say it all the time in our programs, is being able to look at those second and tertiary effects of space advancements. So to your point about launch, what are the other industries and capabilities implicated? Because in a way that’s making smart decisions about what might be coming next and being able to watch that as opposed to just looking at one vertical, understanding all of the other adjacencies that are going to be implicated in its success.

Lesley Conn:

So for example, maybe you’re not the company built the launch vehicle, but maybe you’re the company that makes sure the tower or the mission control is there and fully equipped. Another thing that we’ve seen certainly is that there were some companies initially who were like, we’re going to go out and do on orbit manufacturing or we’re going to do something space related. The more they came to understand space debris, the risk there increasingly are shifts or more companies not only looking at SSA and orbital debris management, but how to track that and share that information.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

Absolutely. I actually have a question from one of our viewers for you, if I could pull it. Oh, okay. So they want to know your perspective on the utilization of artificial intelligence to develop portfolios that hedge risky space investments against less risky terrestrial investments. So essentially, can AI be able to better understand what a good investment is for in space or space to earth?

Lesley Conn:

I think the potential there is certainly strong. I don’t know that I’m well versed enough to be able to say, oh, absolutely, and here’s this platform that’s doing it or this company that is doing that, but certainly there is so much recognition about AI and the analysis that it can provide and the speed with which it can provide that analysis that I certainly would see that evolving and growing.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

I agree. I also think though there would have to be a bit of maybe standardization about what risky means because there’s a lot of subjective things within there of what’s a risky space investment versus what isn’t.

Lesley Conn:

Absolutely. It’s really about the parameters that are set for that AI to be used.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

Another AI question from you for the audience, so the utilization of AI to develop optimal methods and prospects for space-based manufacturing. Have you seen anything in this area?

Lesley Conn:

I think we’re seeing a lot of AI already in use in terms of satellite deployment, satellite maybe not deployment, but AI being a component in satellites and spacecraft and specific mention missions. I needed one more cup of coffee this morning. I think so yes, we are seeing that. I think there’s also a lot of excitement about the potential and there’s some conversations really about how do we make sure AI is not just a one-off here and a one-off here, but that it’s fully integrated across maybe a number of programs, and that by standardizing it and establishing that prototype and the protocols, that really then becomes kind of a multiplier in and of itself.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

Yeah, it’s one of those areas that we are not even scratching the surface of its utilization or integration, so it’s going to be very exciting to see how it benefits the different industries, but there does need to be some sort of guardrails or standardization, and that is really true across most of the ecosystem, even in a lot of the low earth orbit in space servicing and manufacturing. There needs to be some sort of standardization of how to engage and what integration means, and I think we’re going to start seeing that in the years to come,

Lesley Conn:

And there’s still a lot of us, a lot for us to decide and standardize on earth in regard to AI and how that’s used.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

Absolutely. While I still have, I have a final question for you and sort of a softball, but you can take it however you’d like, but what opportunities are you the most excited about in the year ahead?

Lesley Conn:

Probably, and this might be a surprise, but I really think the Europa Clipper mission could be quite fascinating. So that one, I think there’s a lot of excitement about, but I also think that within the next, let’s say 12 months, not necessarily within a year, but within the next 12 months, I think we’ll really have that to use a cliche, that giant leap forward in terms of what is going to happen on the lunar surface. And I think once we get there, that’s where you’ll see all sorts of innovation and additional opportunities realized that we just can’t understand or fully anticipate. Now,

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

That is really going to be a big mental shift because for people that saw the original landing thing, it’s one of those where they remembered where they were when, and I think we’re going to get back to that aha moment where collectively we’re like, wow, it really is a tangible, real thing. We hear about it in the news and we know that there’s a lot of activity, but to your point, I think there’s going to be a mental shift that is going to really view engagement in a different way.

Lesley Conn:

I’m going to be curious to see how many years will it take us when those of us on earth will get an incoming call from the moon and it will be such a regular thing that we’re going to look at our phone and go, I’m going to let that go to voicemail.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

What’s funny about think

Lesley Conn:

Happening, we’ve really established a lunar civilization.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

What’s funny about you saying that, it’s the exact piece. On our last Vector episode, I interviewed Chris Blacker be from Astro Scale, and I asked him, what would be the turning point when you realize that this is a real thing? And he said, when we don’t have to send out press releases about rendezvous and proximity imaging of space debris, he’s like, we were able to do it, and it was this huge press release. He goes, but when it just becomes old hat that, oh, it’s just this again, he goes, that’s when we will know that there’s this operational cadence that’s really going to expand. And to your point, what is once profoundly tremendous becomes sort of routine, that’s really where we want to be.

Lesley Conn:

Absolutely.

Kelli Kedis Ogborn:

Well, Lesley, thank you so, so much. I got so much out of this discussion. I know our viewers did as well. There’s a lot of really interesting comments coming in, so thank you for the work that you do. Thank you for sharing your time with us and really helping qualify some of the information in the Space Report. For anybody listening and watching Space Report is available for subscription. We will make sure to drop a link into the chat of where you can access it. And please stay tuned for Future Vector episodes. Remember that there’s a place for everyone in the global space ecosystem, so thank you for watching.

 

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State of the Space Economy in 2024

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